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the British newspaper Daily Telegraph published an article by US President Barack Obama, in which he urged Britons not to leave the European Union
. “I’m telling you as a friend – Obama says – the EU will make Britain still greater”.
According to the US president, ” America has an interest in the debate about the membership of Britain in the European Union “
Britain’s profitable to be in the European Union, it is from this only wins, Obama said, and this applies to many different spheres of cooperation -. on the fight against terrorism to economy.
is the statement of Barack Obama’s direct interference in British affairs, or is it a friendly advice ally, with whom the US special relationship?
the leading “Fifth floor” Jana Litvinov an interview with Helen Samueli, the referent of the House of Lords of the British Parliament, and independent political analyst Yuri Fedorov.
Jana Litvinova : Helen, for a start I would take the position of eurosceptics and ask you this: do what is right, Barack Obama, whether he is at least three times the US president, to interfere in the internal affairs of the UK ?
Helen Samueli: He has no right. This is independent of whether or not a person eurosceptic. I must say that I too Eurosceptic. Even if President Obama would have spoken out against the EU, this again does not concern him. Of course, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but not everyone. He speaks not as a private person, he speaks as a president of the United States. By the way, it will not be for a long time the president seems to be in the third week of January, he will not be president. Even if we vote to withdraw from the European Union, it is then another two years will continue, so that he did not even see it. It does not concern him. He just speaks, I do not know why. There are two points: first, he is interfering in the internal affairs of its ally. We are really close allies
YA.L :.. But we still different country
X. .With:. on the other hand, the fact that he expresses, is not based on facts. Britain was more or less close to the United States – can agree with it or not, it does not matter – when Tony Blair went against the whole of the European Union to be an ally of President Bush. All this, of course, is not done, we can talk about it a lot
YA.L :.. We’ll talk about that later, because now we vse still considering how Barack Obama made not a deliberate act by the fact that he made this statement, and whether it is more harm than good to the European case is not done. Europe has always belonged to the US intervention is not entirely sympathetic. On the other hand, in Europe it seems to be generally wants Britain remained in the European Union. Yuri, you think, what kind of reaction to the European politicians were to make or have made Obama’s words
Yuri Fedorov:? I would single out two sides of the case. The first side: the effect can produce speech, the article Barack Obama, who has published a Daily Telegraph, however, at the twentieth page, far from the beginning. It is known that the Daily Telegraph refers to the Euro-skeptics, as far as I understand in British politics
YA.L :.. tries to pursue a more or less objective policy. Yes, more skeptical attitude towards Europe, you are right
YF:.. The first question is: what impact will have this article, or, more precisely, the fact that the US president expressed his opinion. Perhaps the council. Maybe he expressed it in a persuasive manner. The second question is: what is actually beneficial to the United Kingdom of Great Britain – to remain in the European Union or, on the contrary, rather the interests of the UK out of the EU is responsible. Regarding the first question, I still would have agreed with his colleague, who spoke just now, that soon it may produce the opposite effect, because the Eurosceptics – that in the UK, in Europe – just say that the United States once again allowed themselves to intervene in the internal affairs of one of the European countries and even in the affairs of Europe. And in general it is not the business of the United States, this is a purely European problems. The United States would have to keep their opinions to themselves
YA.L :.. I’ll tell you more than that, in the UK many believe that this is not purely a European problem and a purely British problem. The British have to solve it themselves, without any regard – neither the US nor Europe
YF:.. No doubt, it all depends on perspective. I’m fairly critical attitude to the Euro-skeptics, living in Europe. It seems to me that this is not adequate to current realities. The second question is: does the US is interested in the fact that the EU was serious, strong organization to intensified integration in Europe? I think yes. Let’s try to look at this problem from another point of view
YA.L :.. that Helen wants to argue about this
hs:. It all depends on who is in the United States. For example, those involved in the defense, related to the defense of the British – distant, deep links, and, of course, relations with other countries through NATO. The European Union is going to create its own army. From the very beginning, as it began to talk – about 90-91 year – is to get out of NATO. So, how does this help the Americans, it is still unknown. But there is in the US government are those who believe and have believed for decades that most good thing – is that Europe has become one country. But it will never happen, because it just can not be. The EU can continue without end, in any form, but it is impossible to say that France and Germany – is one country. To say that the United States is much better, if more will be integration – which means too clearly describe all of the US government and in general all of America
YA.L : Helen.. , another question in this case. When Barack Obama said what he said – it was a statement by him personally – Barack Obama, his statement as a representative of the Democratic Party or – as the representative of the United States, which must meet and articulate all American interests
hs:. As for the democratic party, I do not know, they now have their own problems, they are unlikely to engage the European Union
YA.L.. : They are now engaged in election
hs:.. It is not a situation that can express their opinion. In February next year, he will be able to do it. Now he can not speak politically, it can not just say, “Well, I, Barack Obama, the US president I, but it does not matter, I just like ordinary people say this.” It’s very sad, but true. He says that he expressed this opinion on behalf of the whole country. But if you look, then, at first, most people in this country, the EU is not very interested in, it’s not so important. Second, most politicians are busy election, again, they were not very interested. Even if we look at those parts of the US government or the political arena, which still interests that are engaged in international affairs and defense, and international trade, where the views are totally different. For example, those who are engaged in trade, constantly complain about the European Union, they do not like the European Union. Apparently, on their behalf, Barack Obama does not say. It is not clear from whom he is said
YA.L : Yuri, coming back to what you started to say – with what the same way you look.. on the issue, the European reaction to what is happening
YF:.. From my point of view, Europe, more precisely, European countries or European establishment certainly interested in close cooperation with the United States, primarily in the military field. The existence of NATO and reliance on US military power allows and has allowed European countries to drastically reduce military spending and released funds to send, to refocus on social programs and so on. If we talk about the economy, no doubt, in my view, European countries are interested in economic cooperation with the United States, although, as always, when it comes to economic interests, there are pluses and minuses. These interests may be something the same, something to be opposed. If you look at the situation in its retrospect, try to imagine – though it is very difficult – what will happen in the foreseeable future, I think that what was called interdependence – this is a key trend in the development, at least in the western world ., the Euro-Atlantic civilization
YA.L :. not everyone will agree with this. As far as I understand, you know Europe very well, you do it, you imagine it, you live there. In Europe, Britain recognized the existence of a special relationship with the US and, if found, then look at it rather pleased, or vice versa
YF:?. Let’s see : we are talking about the intellectual, political, if you will, the military elite, or, more precisely, the European establishment. Yes, of course, deny the specific and special relations between the US and the UK would be simply meaningless. They exist, have very deep roots – and cultural, and economic, political, and military, and what you want – it’s a fact. Another question – how to feel about that? Many are treated differently. Some, for instance, skeptics believe that these relationships allow the Americans or the US too much influence on European affairs. From their point of view it is a negative factor, a negative circumstance. But there are other points of view, at least, they are sufficiently widespread establishment rather than in the mass consciousness. There are people who understand that Europe and the United States are associated with each other so strongly that any attempt to weaken this relationship, – I’m not talking about to break, it’s just not possible – will be negative in terms of European impact. Therefore there is no single point of view
YA.L :.. Single point of view on these issues, there is virtually none. Helen Yuri now, from my point of view, said a very important thing, of course, someone comfortable with, someone not, that the United States believes that the United States can influence EU policy too thanks to this special relationship with Britain. It turns out that Britain did in the European Union, not only geographically, but also politically worth some alone, because it is – neither yours nor our
hs: so keep talking, but it is not so, because we are all subject to the laws of the EU and to move away from this impossible
YA.L :.. If only we from he did not leave
hs:.. Then everything will be different, we will have a different union. When people say such things, they believe that the European Union – some simply allies who just give it, give it. The European Union has its own laws, its own high court, its own government. Many people do not like the fact that we choose the parliament, and the parliament have any rights against the European Union does not. Firstly, the UK has really old and profound special relationship to America …
YA.L :. Do not you think that Britain takes a certain special position in the European Union due to their connections with the United States
hs:?. in most things – no. What, for example? If the trade agreements that the European Union is no end to Canada, have been negotiating for years, all can not agree. We do not conduct our negotiations, those negotiations is the European Union. Legislation also we submit even more than many. The only thing that can be said is that sometimes someone like Tony Blair, a little bit coming out of these agreements and is at a close alliance with the United States. But all sorts of military, anti-terrorist attitudes, which together are negotiating – the British and the Americans – and others, this is not the end. No one is saying that if Britain leaves the European Union, the closest America’s relationship with Britain – Barack Obama says it is, but it will not be – and America’s relationship with the rest of Europe to somehow change. Just be sure to conduct, as surely will resent due to trade and when it is necessary, as we have seen in the former Yugoslavia in the 90s, when Europe is unable to cope, the Americans intervene.
YA.L :. Yuri now Helen said that by and large you can scare than anything, perhaps, little will change, because the practical interests better. A couple of months ago, I attended the war games as a rather big European policy – and former and current, and the UK – have discussed what might happen in the case of “brekzita” and how the country itself will lead. You know what struck me? I understand that these policies frolicked and played, it is clear that it was fun, but not seriously, but when they began to discuss Britain’s exit scenario from the European Union, they are all incredibly revived and began to offer scenarios that except the words “let us to revenge “I can not name. Do you think it is, in principle, actually, imagining that we voted against that Europe suddenly decides to act against their interests and solve the British take revenge for the fact that it threw ?
YF: I think this is an emotional outburst, the feeling of being cheated or found a country that went against those trends, the trends that are considered very important and significant. Let’s look again at the problem from a slightly different point of view: what can actually happen with the EU if Britain decides to get out of it? I think here in the first place will increase dramatically the uncertainty of strategic, economic and political situation in Europe. This, in my opinion, the key factor – increased uncertainty, which always entails a certain chaotization policy. People do not know what to expect, considered the most strange and unexpected scenarios. This, of course, will weaken Europe as a whole, and weaken Europe and the European Union, and the United Kingdom, even if it decides to withdraw from the European Union. Although I think this will not happen. Moreover, if to imagine how Russia will react to it, then I think that the Kremlin will be very very happy if Britain left the EU. It will be seen in the Kremlin as a big win – then I do not know: common sense or the Russian influence on the European situation. In different ways this can be treated
YA.L :.. Helen you this categorically disagree
<. strong> hs:. Why suddenly Russia would be happy? I’ve already heard here, too many people say: “How can you vote for” brekzit “if Putin is really like?”. In the first place, but so what? Secondly, why is it like Putin? Because of this will be weaker than the European Union. The European Union is now threatened by him? Absolutely nothing, nothing we can do. Britain does not lead, France and Germany are ongoing negotiations on Ukraine, that there is in the eastern Ukraine. They just spit. negotiate constantly, so what we have achieved? Nothing special. The European Union is absolutely no threat to him. To say that it will be very, very happy – it is not clear what he would be happy
YA.L : Yuri, do you think that Putin will.. happy if Britain leaves? Explain, please answer Helen
YF:.. I totally agree with the fact that the EU does not threaten Putin. But this point of view of common sense, in my opinion, point of view, which corresponds to reality. And in the Kremlin because people think the opposite. It is very difficult to reproduce the logic of thinking of the Kremlin inhabitants, but I am afraid that just as the Kremlin believe that the more united Europe is, the stronger it is, and if it is stronger in relation to Russia, even more strongly as a more effective actor in international relations, the less chance for Russia to achieve its goals in Europe. In this case, let’s look at how the Kremlin can appreciate the collapse or weakening of the EU in the event of Britain from it. The weaker Europe, the more likely Russia – so believe in the Kremlin, I stress, is the Kremlin’s point of view, as far as I understand it, – to impose their views, their views, their position, their interests
. . YA.L : Once we have completely moved away from the US and decided that yes, interferes badly. It is not clear, maybe we will have a chance to come back, but I’ll say this: why, in fact, the output of Britain should be seen as a weakening of the EU?
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